Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: S400 Trigger

  1. #1
    Sharp Shooter

    User Info Menu

    Default S400 Trigger

    I just want to clear something up. I have now read on a couple of threads of people saying that the S400/MPR has a competition trigger or suggest that you could ad a competition trigger (by what I assume is the MPR trigger post and shoe).

    The S400/MPR does not have a competition or match grade trigger. It does have a true 2 stage trigger. The older S400's had two sears in the trigger mechanism and the new S400/MPR has got 3 sears. The actual trigger (only the part your finger touches) of the S400 is replaced in the MPR by a post and shoe similiar to the EV2. The 3 sear trigger in my opinion feels better than the old 2 stage trigger.

    No matter how much you tune or how fine you try to adjust your trigger it will never be a match grade unit. This is not any negativity towards the S400, which in my opinion has a very acceptable trigger. It would have been nice if AA made a match grade unit for the S400/MPR and offered it as an upgrade, but to my knowledge they don't.

    Please feel free to comment if you want, this is just as far as my little knowledge goes and if I am wrong I will apologize for the wrong statements I have made.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  2. #2
    Sharp Shooter
    The Professor

    User Info Menu

    Default

    Define 'match grade'.

    IMO with a little careful work and setting up the 400 series trigger can give trigger pull characteristics equal to those found on dedicated target rifles. The factory 3 sear versions take more work to get up to the standard as the manufacturing process of the sears has changed.

    The hand made conversions of the two sear units are stunningly good but of course take a lot longer to create.

    The addition of the MPR pattern blade gives the ability to position the trigger shoe to the shooter's preference.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  3. #3
    Inactive Member

    User Info Menu

    Default

    Not that it matters a lot but the S400 had a three sear trigger for a couple of years now. It is only the ones with the "old" stippling and if I remember correctly, without the safety catch, that had two sears. I had one of them and I recon that specific rifle was the best and most accurate rifle ever manufactured by AA. I miss it dearly. I personally could not distinguish between that trigger and my daughter's three sear trigger. It broke as clear as any trigger, competition or not. Very few of us, in my opinion, will notice the difference any how.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  4. #4
    Sharp Shooter
    SAFTAA FT Colours '10

    User Info Menu

    Default

    I must say.. only thing I found on the 400 trigger that may not be comparable to the steyrs etc is the weight. adjusting the weight down to the point where the sears will engage again if you release the trigger half way is still heavier than the so called match triggers. other than that the release is very predictable etc.. Dale, will polishing the seers asist with this or is this the way the cookie crumbles?
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  5. #5
    Sharp Shooter

    User Info Menu

    Default

    Sorry "match grade" was used loosely, what I meant was trigger units like the ones found on the EV2, Steyr, Dommie and FWB

    I guess if you use a Hatsan in a competition it also has a competition trigger

    JTK, a lot of it has to do with friction - the more you reduce this the lighter and smoother it will be.
    Last edited by Arnold; 10-11-08 at 13:22.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  6. #6
    Sharp Shooter
    The Professor

    User Info Menu

    Default

    JTK, polishing helps but under no circumstances alter the angles of the egagement surfaces as that will surely bugger things up.

    Another thing that seriously improves the 400 series trigger is to lose the o-rings that retain the middle and bottom (3rd) sears and substitute in very small (M2) stainless steel shim washers.

    Those o-rings only serve to stop the sears moving out of position, but tended to be compressed by the side plate and imposed a loading on the sears which detracts from the pull characteristics. Using a small stack of shims to prevent the sears floating on their pins, but without binding on the cover plate really makes a serious difference.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  7. #7
    Sharp Shooter
    SAFTAA FT Colours '10

    User Info Menu

    Default

    thanks Dale, I have seen that mod somewhere.. believe the person used plastic washers? Will go have a look for m2 stainless shim washers.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  8. #8
    Sharp Shooter

    User Info Menu

    Default

    I also use metal washers to do the shimming and have simmed all my the S400's I had. It does make a huge difference compared to the o-rings.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  9. #9
    Sharp Shooter
    The Professor

    User Info Menu

    Default

    As an interesting aside on trigger settings, I recall reading a piece by Terry Doe (now editor of Airgun World) in his former monthly column entitled FT Comment.

    One interesting point that Terry made was to not fall into a trap of setting your trigger so light that the rifle fired if a mosquito farted in the vicinity. While you might find such a trigger controllable in the calm of a practice session, add the pressure and nerves of competition shooting and you might find yourself losing points by not being able to adequately control such a light trigger under competition pressures..........

    Having fallen into the trap myself many years back, I think he made a very valid point that is worth bearing in mind. The relevance here being even though the 400 series trigger may not adjust down to a tiny release weight it may not be a bad thing and if you work with it will not hinder your shooting.

    I think some shooters can be overly anal about 'my triggers lighter than yours'
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  10. #10
    Sharp Shooter
    SAFTAA FT Colours '10

    User Info Menu

    Default

    I aggree Dale, whiles the trigger certainly is 100% as is I do find myself sometime expecting it to relese and I have to add a little more weight. This would suggest to me that for me it may be a little to heavy. I will find the washers and shim it.

    Arnold, where did you find the right washers? I get the feeling normal m2 washers will be too thick?
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  11. #11
    Sharp Shooter

    User Info Menu

    Default

    Got it from "Eikestad bolt & nut", the M2 washers are thin and I used a couple to get the spacing right.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  12. #12
    Sharp Shooter

    User Info Menu

    Default

    Dale, I think most of the arguements result from statements like 'my trigger is lighter than yours' or 'my S400 trigger can adjust just as light as your 10m match rifle's trigger'.

    Personally I like a light trigger. The big thing for me is predictability, even if the triger is a bit heavier.
    Last edited by Arnold; 10-11-08 at 16:47.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  13. #13
    Protea FT Team '12

    User Info Menu

    Default

    The "Match trigger" upgrade as mentioned in the beginning is a term used wrong as you said Arnold. I bought the "Match" upgrade and it only applies in reality to a adjustable trigger blade assembly only. Cost about R400 to buy. nothing is done to the sears or any of the other components. I would also like to do some more work on the trigger shims , but I don't think I would really feel the difference yet. For met the S400 has a very nice trigger and with the adjustable blade allready feels alot better.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums

  14. #14
    Protea FT Team '09/'10

    User Info Menu

    Default

    imo, i would say the only difference with ta match grade trigger would be a sear mechanism where all the creep has been removed, adjustable pull weight and then the trigger blade assembly which gives you option to adjust according to your personal preference, ito position, angle and oh yes, first & second stage travel.
    I myself prefer a long 1st stage with the second breaking very clean on final pull through second stage - gives you more to work with when shooting FT.
    Sign Up To Air Rifle SA Forums


Similar Threads

  1. S400 trigger guard
    By Saxon in forum Airgun Discussions
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 01-07-12, 19:17
  2. Lube on a S400 trigger?
    By Mac in forum Airgun Discussions
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 20-08-09, 14:50

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Friends of Air Rifle SA